SB-1 Space Bee

No if it was just the battery, they’d be on easy street. It’s hard to get much specifically from the very short updates, which have even been slipping lately. The latest said the firmware engineer had quit ( no reason given ). And with the new design and the new microcontroller – ( I had talked about the redesign up thread. Note it was a redesign, not a tweaking on the design. ) – they now have no one that knows the code to port it to the new hardware design, likely a different hardware interface, etc. I’m guessing this must be a fair amount of work. Without that you can’t completely test the new design, and shouldn’t commit to any production, hence can’t commit to an order of parts. Plus they’ll need to get a mostly working hardware prototype to do international agency testing, which they should complete before they order production component parts to manufacture boards.

It was fairly recent too they were dealing with mechanical problems with the keyboard and aluminum case. You can’t be creating the world’s slimmest keyboard and expect things like this to be easy to do.

They had 4 months or so after they were Kickstarted before Covid. They had planned to ship in 8 months. Instead they end up doing a redesign, and were poorly prepared to deal with mechanical issues. It’s very hard to design and develop a new electronic product from scratch. My read though, is they had not done enough to be prepared before they Kickstarted.

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is the price of this edging towards the Take5 (for example) recent announcement ?
i admire their efforts but perhaps the real world is moving onwards and upwards.

Absolutely, I did a post about market windows over in the crowdfunding page. And you’re right re5et, the world just goes right on by.

Hopefully for Superlative there is enough special in this design for it to carry through.

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I think they can do it, looks super sick and I’d definitely like to have one… as long as a decksaver comes out for it. Still watching this project.

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You neglected to mention the other delay, as stated in the first sentence of the Kickstarter update that you’re referring to:

“There was recently a death in my immediate family that required me to step away from the project for a period of time.”

(I have no investment in the SB01, other than I think it’s cool AF, and I hope they get through this doldrum.)

My considered choice not neglect. I stand by my post.

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The Black should do it.

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It was so super and nice and simple … really hope to hear from them soon and maybe with next instrument?! (modern days black Juno )?

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/superlative/sb01-analog-synthesizer-of-the-future/posts/3357995

new update!

We are continuing with steady progress into the end of the year.

With new engineering support in place we have finally validated our last module board and are on track to build a full revision prototype with the necessary improvements soon. We are also in the midst of an overdue firmware sprint, and our firmware collaborator is implementing several new features to catch up to the current state of our electrical design.

Since the last update we have also finally secured production stock of all long lead time ICs used in the design, and are moving onto more readily available passives and components next. Depending on upcoming supplier deliveries of production quantity parts, we are aiming for the production pilot prototype soon after the holidays.

-Superlative

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Superlative did updates on KS for both January and February.

They’re still changing the electronics around and making major sorts of changes. They also have now bought a reflow oven to streamline prototyping, so are they planning more changes ?

A project’s electronics doesn’t need to be 100% complete before taking customer’s money, but it ought to be pretty close to complete, with only tweaking left. They’re still in design, pushing toward two years after the original ship date.

Was looking on KS at all the synthesizer projects started long after the SB01 that are done, shipped, selling in retail, and onto a third firmware revision.

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Yeah… this and the VS-1 pretty much vanished. Shame, I was excited for both.

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Every single electronic device manufacturer is experiencing severe supply chain issues, and is needing to substitute parts AND redesign for subs or routing around however they can.

I’m not saying that Superlative have made no mistakes here, I have no insight into their operations and have no financial stake in either way (considered but did not kickstart)

But none of this is unsurprising in the continuing pandemic.

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Yeah it seems like a total no compromises product which means more time unfortunately, especially when comes to tweaks for actual production especially when chip shortages are coming in. So many kickstarter products build quality falls way short of expectations because they are trying to meet deadlines and are willing to make pretty substantial compromises. I suppose when it actually comes we will see if the time was worth it, but I certainly hope people who backed get a superb product. I want to say the TE-02 spacecase guy has had to redesign almost half his production boards after waiting months from manufacturers with moving deadlines and prices, likely to be a while before that is complete.

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To be fair the electronics change is swapping their bespoke filter designed IC for an IC that only recently became available. The AS3109 is a drop in replacement for the R3109 VCF ICs found on vintage Roland synths.

Its entirely possible that there chip shortages, which required them to change the schematics an thus the layout.

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Yeah, another project I hope comes to fruition while also completely understanding the annoyance of backers.

Spent five years already waiting for my Wond II with a redesign or two in between, i expect to one day receive it, but bleh.

I’m going to stick by my post. I’ve added the last three updates for anyone seeking more information.

Sure there’s a parts supply problem. But they said in November, “Since the last update we have also finally secured production stock of all long lead time ICs used in the design, and are moving onto more readily available passives and components next." So they have the parts.

And like I said and again stick by, they should have had the parts orders ready before the KS check hit their bank. They suddenly discover that they need a six layer board in January, come on, that also would have been knowable before they even went on KS.

Read the other updates too. Someone else can count the times throughout this project that they have expanded the project ( it’s called mission creep ) rather than making the sensible though difficult engineering decision to accept what is good enough, close the design, and move on to production.

I’ve done this level of project myself, and i’ve managed projects this size and much larger. I’ve slipped schedule, and dealt with supply issues. This one though just doesn’t wash.

November

We are continuing with steady progress into the end of the year.

With new engineering support in place we have finally validated our last module board and are on track to build a full revision prototype with the necessary improvements soon. We are also in the midst of an overdue firmware sprint, and our firmware collaborator is implementing several new features to catch up to the current state of our electrical design.

Since the last update we have also finally secured production stock of all long lead time ICs used in the design, and are moving onto more readily available passives and components next. Depending on upcoming supplier deliveries of production quantity parts, we are aiming for the production pilot prototype soon after the holidays.

-Superlative

January

Happy new year everyone. We are doing everything in our power to ship the SB01 as soon as possible this year.

Our firmware development sprint through the holidays was successful, and we now have a USB stack with both USB host and device, dual-role power, USB MIDI working for the first time. This was a major milestone, as it means we have now completed the foundation for all major USB features and stretch goals on our new microcontroller. This also clears the path to offer the keytar grip accessory as a USB device, which will be detailed in another update.

On the electrical side we have further refined and fixed issues with our last module board prototype. Due to component density this required us moving up to a 6-layer board and investing time on a new and final layout. Improvements are now being made on the main analog board and both board candidates are scheduled to be fabricated after the upcoming CNY holiday.

-Superlative

February

The main analog board has been undergoing additional design review and layout refinement to match the module board, and we are ordering both boards for test and assembly in the upcoming weeks.

As a side effect of our extended timeline, we were able to incorporate the newly offered AS3109 voltage controlled filter IC to replace our discrete clone with a single part, simplifying the signal path as close as we can to the original. Despite the work completed in reverse engineering the original filter IC, we would have chosen this solution from the start and are happy to include it in the final version.

In other news, we have installed a production grade reflow oven to use for all current and future prototyping needs. In-house assembly has proven faster than outsourced assembly in the current landscape, and rather than ship our critical parts and face long lead times we hope to meet our development needs faster by leveraging the tools and components we now have in-hand.

-Superlative

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I agree with all you’ve said, but it’s all just frosting on top of the big, bold-lettered claim in their original kickstarter:

WE ARE READY FOR PRODUCTION

To indicate where we are in this process, we have:

• Engineered the design to be manufactured at scale
• Built and tested 6 generations of prototypes
• Tested a wide range of use cases and scenarios
• Written and optimized our firmware and MIDI I/O
• Road-tested our prototypes across the world

Every bit of that seems highly suspect in retrospect.

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The last 100% always takes the longest.

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I can’t imagine what might have happened in between :slight_smile:

I think you’re hinting at the pandemic and the shortages that followed. Please forgive me if I’m barking up the wrong tree here.

But that’s the thing, though. Things production ready in 2019 didn’t get hit by the supply shortage. Things production ready in 2019 weren’t writing their USB and MIDI stacks or securing ICs in late 2021 or “reviewing changes” to the main analog board(!!) well into 2022. And they wouldn’t even dream of having any use for a reflow oven.

I don’t doubt all this work is now taking longer because of the pandemic. But it was supposed to have already been done. The long timelines caused by the supply shortage only exposed that they were not as ready as they thought they were.

Which, by the way, is not me assigning any malice or fraudulent intent to the Superlative team. I, personally, believe they actually thought they were ready. But only because their deep inexperience hid all the work that was actually left to be done.

The problem is, rather than own up to that, bring in more eyes, commit to the tradeoffs their misestimations will force them to make, etc. they continue to make excuses and kick the can down the road. Which, you know, whatever floats your boat. That rubs some people the wrong way and others not.

But either way it’s not great behavior to see from an engineering team one hopes will ultimately ship something.

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