So I use all the elektron stuff for years now (except digitakt and model:samples because I have a octatrack). After recently using the model:cycles it really made me rethink how you could ideally interface with elektron devices - so here’s the idea: make an affordable controller that can plug into the devices that don’t have any menu diving what so ever so everything is on the front, it would just be used as a midi controller and open everything up kind of like was the idea on the model samples and cycles where more things are just available - what I noticed right away is how it changes everything with how you use the devices typically for the better and its a more efficient workflow. This being said, I still don’t mind the menu diving (its def not a deal breaker), but it would just be an awesome addition to have a controller as well, that seamlessly connects with elektron gear made by elektron with no or minimal screen/menu diving. This would also increase the lifespan of the devices as you would do most playing and button presses on the controller, keeping your synth itself clean and intact a lot better for much longer. I really think it would add value to the instruments.
Haha, beat me to it.
Interesting, do you use this midi controller? So can it connect specifically to all (?) midi ccs on elektron mk1 units automatically (how about mk2? not sure if there was much difference in the midi implementation between the mk1 or mk2 or not…so maybe its still is completely compatible with mk2?) —or is this controller just set up to have the same amount of pots and things so you have to pre program to each midi cc?
Yes, this is similar to what I am talking about, but I feel like with Elektron making one themselves (maybe with the same feel and form factor as their model cycles/samples line) would be ideal since they could probably design it to perfectly fit their instruments and design them from the ground up as like $200-500 midi controllers for each machine - that would be super useful.
It looks like it would not light up with red leds when you hold down sequencer steps to show you which parameters are p-locked or not, which is something I really like and find useful on samples/cycles - its the big reason I want elektron to create dedicated controllers for their machines and I created this post.
Ive never used it other than to have read the designer made them specifically with Elektron in mind, but might be more suited to Mk1 in form factor…here is the thread.
I will check that out. Not sure if there are leds on the pots of ‘the new module’ that would light up to display when parameter locks are active for specific midi ccs. I am guessing it doesn’t do that, but idk. So yeah I still think it would be dope if Elektron made dedicated controllers, although I am not crying about it - its more of a “this would be a dream come true” request, its one step closer to perfecting workflow even further on the machines.
How should any MIDI controller automatically identify what is on the other side of a MIDI cable? Even Elektron would not be able to do that without any kind of dirty MIDI hack.
There are some MIDI Controllers out there, that are really awesome. Faderfox has a few, Electra.One is what I use, the Livid CTRL:R seems to bring a lot of possibilities too.
Yes, all of them have to be somehow configured, but once you set them up for your needs, you are good to go. Most of them have different Presets you can load from the device, so you don’t have to stay with one configuration.
I have one preset, where I control my Virus, my Rytm mk2 and my OT mk2 with. All from One device, controlling exactly those features I need. (Macros on the Virus, where I can bind everything I need to change to, independently of the sound, Performances on the Rytm for exactly that reason and some special Features on the OT that I use all the time. It really works awesome. And as soon as I switch to for example: Circuit Tracks + Micromonsta2, I change to that Preset and have everything for that setup in control again, with only 2 button presses.
Right, I understand. I meant that it was ‘prerouted or presetup’ to each cc value based on the elektron midi implementation, not that it figured it out automatically somehow through a midi connection (side note, I am pretty sure midi 2.0 protocol may be able to do something like this if I remember correctly, or they are working towards it for devices which will have midi 2.0, although its not all set in stone yet…) - so ‘automatically’ was the wrong word - just meant pre-setup. Kind of like how a komplete controller is mapped to the midi ccs in certain instruments because it was already pre-routed to those parameters…
Anyways, thanks for controller ideas. And right, having controller setups for the main parameters you use and leaving things out which you don’t makes a lot of sense too. I still think elektron would be able to make the best controllers for their devices which minimize the amount of menu diving, but be checking out alternatives for the time being, looks like theres lots of options.
Yes, I understand, what you mean, but is that useable? The bigger devices should be around 100 different CC values. Some change based on what Maschine is selected (Rytm, OT). However you want to setup that device, I am not quite sure, if that would be a good choice to work with. That would be tons of Page-Flipping to access all parameters, of which you won’t use more than you use. If you work with something like the trinity, that will be 300 different CC Values you have access too. I am quite sure, that there is no way to make this an awesome user experience.
Yeah I am saying I actually do not want to use something where I have to flip pages or at least where I can minimize it and just access controls directly (ideally). What I am saying is imagine an analog rytm controller that was laid out like the cycles or samples in that all the paramaters were knobs with no page flipping or accessing/switching menus, etc. that would improve the workflow. So there would be like 60-80 knobs for the paramaters covering each page of the digitone for example, on a device such as rytm or octatrack or four it would be as many knobs for how ever many parameters that were on that device…theres already about that many knobs/buttons on cycles & samples - so if you double it would easily have enough controls. And then i’d imagine it would be cheaper to build since its just a controller - not a synth - so I feel like they could make a pretty sweet one realistically and it would be helpful for those people looking to prolong the life of their instruments and to have a improved workflow on each of them.
Ah, okay, no, that would not be for me. Having 400-500 knobs on my table wouldn’t help me. On a jam, I maybe change 5-6 Parameters manually per device. For that I would have to locate 15 out of 400 knobs and mess up the jam, if I touch the wrong one. But I might fall out here, I am totally fine with the workflow when creating tunes, because it is very fast on Electron devices.
Money wise its not that easy as you might think. Endless Encoders take up lots of I/O on a microcontroller. Checking for changes either needs tons of Interrupts or “a lot of time” to query and evaluate them all. You can reduce the amount of I/Os (no microcontroller comes with that many) but only my adding time to read them aka Latency. Building a nice Controller with 100 Encoders is a ton of work and hardware to make good. And that’s not it. You need to see what the current value of every encoder is. So you either need a very big Screen, multiple screens (like on the hydra synth or the Maschine) or LED Rings, that again need another set of I/Os or run serial, that adds a lot of latency to the device. If modern microcontrollers lack one thing, its I/Os. Even the big ones won’t come with enough.
Building a digital synth, like the Digitone is, is way cheaper, hardware-wise.
In the manual is explained which parameters the presets control, but you can ofc make your own mappings.
Presets included for A4/OT and Rytm MK1s and Ableton Live.
MX12
Well its thats a matter of personal preference. I am not saying the workflow is slow on elektrons - def not, it just would be improved significantly in my opinion - if you have used a model cycles or samples that is the backdrop or feeling of workflow I am coming from here - I would not have a problem locating the controls and I would likely use a lot more of them to change the sound not just 5-6, that would be really useful. I think others may agree or disagree, but thats also why some like some synths and others don’t. As I say, I think would be super useful, but it by no means is me bashing elektron. I am speaking in ‘an ideal world’ where elektron makes dedicated controllers for their machines for those people who want it - those who don’t wont have to bother - I feel like a majority would want something like this - I guess you’d have to make a poll.
Right. Yeah I figured it must be preset up to the cc values of the mk1 devices found in the back of each manual. the new module does probably look like prob one of the best options though since it was specifically tailored to work well with elektron even though it can be used for other things too…
Musicstore, Session Music and other have them in stock, available in 4-6 weeks at Thomann. Doesn’t seem they’re discontinued, but you could ask Faderfox.
Edit, Faderfox usually clearly labels products as discontinued.
Oh ok great. Thanks, will look into these, seems like its 96 knobs + 12 sliders if you combine both of them (mx12 & pc12) which would cover either the octatrack four or rytm…you know if the knobs light up when you hold a step to show which parameters are locked?
You mean, hold a step on an Elektron and p-locked parameters light up on the knobs on the controller?
For that to work, Elektron boxes would either need to send information on p-locks over midi (which they don’t do) or the Elektron boxes would need to send p-locks to the controllers on their own protocol.
Maybe if Elektron would collab with Faderfox or develop their own controllers…
…if there will ever be another swedish attempt to the low price segment, dedicated controllers with a “naked” sequencer engine and various knobs and buttons to twiddle, that can adress right out of the box all swedish ball park should be THE NEXT PRODUCT RANGE…
a model:control…so to say…yup…i’d be all in for that…
There indeed isn’t a controller that seamlessly integrates with something like the AR. See thread here for many considerations on controllers, parameter feedback, value jumps when switching kits etc:
thanks ill def check it out!