I just did…Thanks for the reminder. I’ve got a Desktop OB-6 if this matters.
It’s so annoying, and the reason why I don’t use MPE at all with it. Here’s a quick, horrible example to illustrate.
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Indeed, it’s time to test MPE as much as we can so that we can push all the bugs we can.
Can you play pads with OB-6 from Osmose? I don’t seem to be able to do so, as if the gate signal was not successfully transmitted.
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Absolutely no issue with pads. That’s weird, maybe aftertouch routed to the AMP ?
OK, so it’s me. I prefer this ^^
I want one of these something fierce.
If anybody isn’t gelling with theirs, sling me a message and I’d be more than happy to take it off your hands.
Don’t like my chances though. People seem very impressed so far! Hope you are all enjoying!
I don’t have an OB-6… but as mentioned above, Y is going to present a challenge for most MPE presets on many synth.
(and, also why continuum presets on the Osmose will be a little ‘odd’)
tl;dr;
simple explanation :
other MPE controllers (and so presets) treat Y as bipolar,
Osmose treats Y as unipolar.
so, at and before trigger point on Osmose, most presets are going to treat Y are fully negative.
which is not what you’d want/expect, which is zero.
there are other details, like Y not coming in till max Z, but the Y unipolar is the biggie.
more details…
on ALL other MPE controllers, you can kind of view Y as being bi-polar. ( * )
i.e. 0-63 = -1 to 0, 64 = 0 , 65->127 = 0 to 1.
this is because the Y axis has a centre.
therefore presets are make along that assumption.
this is NOT how the Osmose works… it essentially has a unipolar view of Y , so 0 to 1.
at the ‘trigger point’ you are at 0 , and push for more
so you can imagine, there is always an envelope that where Y rises and falls.
so now imagine a very simple patch created for an MPE preset, where Y is used to modulate filter cutoff, all the way from close to open, this would have the Y=64 set at about half way cutoff.
so now on the Osmose, when you hit the trigger you will FULLY close the filter … not what you would expect !
also another aspect of this is Y = 0, until Z is at full pressure, imagine what that does in the above example!
so basically all MPE presets will to some extent be ‘broken’, but some you’ll notice more than others.
of course there are workarounds/solutions.
basically the essence of each is the same, allow Y to be treated as a unipolar value.
(of course, this ‘limits’ the effect as we will see below, but makes if partially as ‘intended’)
so if we, change the preset in above example, offset and scale Y , so that the cutoff only runs from its mid point to fully open. … so we loose the the ‘darkening’ of the filter.
so in reality, you may want to adjust the initial cutoff point
I get that some, especially those of us who have other MPE controllers, will think this is a limitation.
and that is one way to look at it… but one I try to avoid.
all MPE surfaces are different, they have different dynamics, different feels…
if I play the Eagan Matrix preset with my Eigenharp, a Madrona Labs Soundplane, Continuum… even though they all use Y the same way, the preset will sound and feel completely different.
this is the strength the EM, its is ‘tuned’ to the surface, and to a lesser extent this is true of other MPE synths.
SO… reality is, we have always had to tinker with MPE presets to get them to fit the controller we are using, so no difference here with the Osmose.
and in the same way, when we do this, we aim to make the preset work best for the surface we have… and can ignore ‘what it should/might be’ 
of course, I do recognise, this is going to catch a LOT of people out… who will view MPE as MPE.
though, for me, its part of learning your instrument.
I think there is a possible firmware solution for the Osmose…
they could allow an option that Y only sends 64 to 127, so unipolar mode.
its not ideal, (so I understand why its not there !) , as we basically only get 6 bits (rather than 7) resolution, but would be a useful ‘compatibility’ mode.
( * ) ok, this is not 100% accurate, I mean you could view that you play the continuum from the bottom up… and that the bottom was neutral, but most assume the centre is neutral.
and if we get into ‘relative Y’ then we can see again, how this bi-polar nature is exhibited.
and for sure, theres bound to be a controller thats an exception to this, but having played all of the ‘big players’ in this area, I can say they generally assume centre = neutral.
IMO, the lack of “bipolar MPE-Y” is not a big issue on the Osmose.
First of all, MPE Y can be unipolar or bipolar on other MPE controllers but it does not have to be both.
Linnstrument as a controller supports both unipolar (absolute) and bipolar (relative): “Normally the value sent for Timbre/Y has a range of 0 to 127. […] If [relative is] on, a CC value of 64 is sent at first regardless of the position of touch, and subsequent Y-axis movements increase or decrease that value.” Linnstrument even allows you to set the center to something else in relative mode and to change or invert the lower and upper bounds in absolute mode.
Hydrasynth as a sound source responds to both MPE-Yabs and MPE-Yrel modes thanks to its flexible mod matrix, relative being the one that is centred.
I also think that many Continuum presets sound pretty good on the Osmose, some even better than the Osmose’s specifically designed instances of those same presets (eg Living Pad). Quite a few Continuum presets do also not make use of all the dimensions at the same time, so that you may find your preset coming without Y at all.
There is no gate problem with the OB-6 & Osmose pairing. It sounds like you have now figured your issue out. Would you mind briefly describing what it was so that others can avoid the same issue and the loose ends of the conversation are nicely tidied up? Thanks!
The Osmose actually has two different MIDI output layers. One of them is the Haken stuff that can indeed be configured on a per-patch basis using the EaganMatrix editor in the way you describe. By default this layer is only output to the 2nd MIDI port of the USB connector.
The MIDI output layer that Osmose users are most likely to try with external synths is a completely different thing, handled by Expressive E, and is configured using on-screen settings that exist in the Osmose. It can be set to MPE or various forms of more traditional MIDI, the range of channels used in MPE and other modes can be changed, it has its own pitch bend range settings, sensitivity settings, and things like a value that determines how far down you need to press a key before the initial note on message is sent. By default this form of MIDI comes out of the 1st USB MIDI port and the DIN output port, but this can be changed using some not-so-obvious settings, eg it is possible to get Hakens version of MIDI to come out of the DIN port instead, if you set the DIN mode to ‘cvc’ in Osmoses settings.
Expressive E’s layer doesnt support MPE+, and doesnt output the pressure-weighted portamento form of pitch bends or the arpeggiator. They plan to add the arpeggiator in a future firmware update but are saying that pressure-weighted portamento wont be available for now due to a patent issue.
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It was just a suggestion of something to try to get MPE response since the user wasn’t getting it.
This may be my biggest disappointment with the Osmose. I mean, I get why they did it, and I do appreciate that it is a clever implementation, if I understand it correctly, but I really like being able to manipulate the x, y and z axes simultaneously like I can on the Linnstrument where I can apply pressure (z), rotate a finger left and right (x) and then also back and forth (y). The one thing I am missing with the Linnstrument is key travel (obviously), which would allow me significantly more control over pressure, without having to go to aftertouch (which I do not like). So, is this how the Osmose expressiveness works: hit a key (gate), apply pressure (z axis expression), at some point hit (y axis expression), go all the way down, slide key (x axis, pitch bend), then also aftertouch? I am probably getting this wrong, but not exactly clear from the videos I’ve seen so far.
yes, your basic understanding is correct.
(though Id highlight x/pitchbend is active throughout travel)
though I think there a couple of things that are difficult to express without having played the Osmose.
- Z is very sensitive, you can play it extremely lightly… so can ‘play the envelope’, also has a nice depth to it.
- Y aka aftertouch, has a very definite feel to it, and is quite deep - it is NOT like aftertouch on other keyboards.
- Y is very controllable, again sensitive, and you don’t ‘accidentally’ play it at the end of Z.
but the important aspect of all of this, is how the Osmose brings this together, and how it plays as an instrument.
its all well and good talking about tech specs, mpe , mpe+, but frankly these are at the end of the day pretty unimportant.
to get the most from the Osmose, like any expressive controller, you will have to use/write presets that are built for the way it is.
this is why the Eagan Matrix was chosen as a synth engine because its the only engine, thats is built to really put the surface at the core of sound design… that is what all the (mythical) scary stuff in the matrix is all about.
so yeah as a “generic” mpe controller, for sure, Id probably go for something else… unless piano layout/feel is important to you.
there are benefits and drawbacks to them all.
I really think a lot of the comparisons around are apple n’ oranges.
all of them have to be assessed by what they are, and what you need.
… none of them does everything, and that’ll never change.
I think the Osmose is great for what it does…
…but it doesn’t stop me reaching for my Eigenharps, and Ive also been messing with the Erae Touch into the Eagan Matrix., they all bring something different.
btw: historical note…
remember the first Roli , Seaboard Grand, did not feature Y at all !
the reason… was the same as the Osmose, if you play piano, you hands move along the Y axis to reach certain chords (etc) .
its difficult/impossible to not to this , so Y cannot be independent in this manner.
other controllers get around this in different ways, e.g. isomorphic layouts, or the continuums linear layout…
but those lack the familiarity of the piano, which is what the Roli and Osmose are targeting.
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My most important consideration–this, and the fact that it is poly-pressure.
yeah, I think its the heart of the Osmose.
actually, the Z ‘feel’ differs tremendously between controllers, and is probably the defining element of each. if the Z is light, responsive… I generally feel pretty connected… but, it’s where some controllers ‘lack’ (at least for my taste).
so its important element…as is the plunge depth
its massive on the Continuum, but pretty short on most…
Osmose is not as deep as continuum, but much deeper than others, and its 2 stage feel is definitely interesting, both playing and from a sound design side.
I should also say the weighted portamento is absolutely fantastic…
when I first heard about it, I was pretty skeptic … but reality is, it really feels natural to play…
sure its not as fun/natural as sliding on a continuous surface,
but it truly makes slides a possibility on the Osmose… and that was something I would have missed.
I really do wish there were somewhere around here that had an Osmose I could try (Minneapolis). I don’t even foresee that in the future any music store around here will have one on display.
In the best of all worlds, I could afford and justify a Continuum Slim, but no chance there. I’d need to sell most of my gear to get there, and don’t want to do that.
They actually have an Osmose-preorder-specific store list on their website, which also has a little icon which shows which stores have/will have demo units. And by the looks of various store demo videos that emerged online recently, I think they already shipped a bunch of demo units. However the number of US stores with demo units is very small on the current list:
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Thanks for the info. My local store will have a demo unit, nice! Not that I need to be convince but it’s cool for others.
Edit : they already have it since 2 weeks.
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Another key feature which is easily overlooked on the Osmose, because it seems almost too banal, is the differentiation you get from playing hard or articulate staccato with one finger/hand and soft or mushy legato with the other. With the right preset, it’s just perfect. On the Linnstrument you can do that as well, though with less travel it is more difficult to wield (note: I also love my Linnstrument 
).
Add to this, the beautifully rhythmic gesture that you can perform on Z with a little icing of Y every now and then, that’s where the Osmose’s Z-Y dependence begins to shine. In the end, it boils down to how your patch responds to all of this.
While Continuum might be the king of expression, I’ve also read that it appears to be notoriously difficult to play chords on it.
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Standardly spaced chords up to two fingers left + three fingers right aren’t terribly difficult, depending on tempo, etc. The real pain with Continuum is due to parallax when reaching to play notes outside the two octave range that centers on your nose. You have to change head position to reduce your eyes’ angle, or else it’s easy to miss by a little bit and sound out of tune. You get more and more used to that over time so that it’s not so bad, depending on the kind of music you’re playing. For any kind of X-dimension fingering change, though, you can never take your eyes off the keyboard as you can do rather easily on a standard 3D piano layout.