Program change messages not handled as expected

Elektron Gear Analog Rytm
#62

Well thought !

#63

There you are ! Itā€™s even simpler since you actually donā€™t need stop command, restart will do the trick to avoid it being interpretd as continue message. For consistency, setup pcghlenght to 2 steps.

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#64

As a reminder any elektron machine with multimap feature enabled can do that with midi notes. Even the pretty old machinedrum can do thisā€¦Any discussion with elektron support regarding this subject has always been pretty surreal.

1 Like
#65

You add the PC change device to a track, then insert the HW instrument device into its chain to send the PC to your Rytm. Then you automate the changes within a given clip. Itā€™s a little bit fiddly but you can save the numbered clips into the browser for future use.

Jim

1 Like
#66

Yeah, I know about multimap, but program change is a standard and should work correctly. Multimap is a band aid. I used to use an OT as the brain for many years and so it never really bothered me, but since switching to MPC, itā€™s depressing as hell. You canā€™t even set a PC at all for the Rytm using either the Track PC box or automation because it always starts 1 step out of sync as soon as you doā€¦ it just feels like arrogance to me and definitely puts me off buying future boxes that inherit this flaw. They should have addressed it a decade ago. I donā€™t have any other complaints.

#67

Official reason is : midi cannot see the future and then will lead to timing issueā€¦
Proven wrong so many times by their own multimap and by the fact that using an external device to achieve this,sending multiple commands works like a charm even with midi latencyā€¦

I hear you !

1 Like
#68

Yeah and your video shows they could even hack a solution into the firmware to achieve what you have here (though doubtful it would be necessary to do it that way). Yeah, as you say multimap proves itā€™s possible. Thereā€™s also direct change on the A4 which does exactly what it states from the interface but not by PCā€¦

Everytime thereā€™s a firmware update for the boxes I own itā€™s all I hope for. The Rytm doesnā€™t even have multimap as an option to work around it.

#69

Itā€™s so crazy that this hasnā€™t been fixed when it works perfectly using direct change within the unit it self, surely you could just set it so the program change triggers the same thing the buttons on the unit do.

As many have said, multi map on other units show its possible, multi map on the rytm would be an amazing feature regardless but would also be great to have this an option as a work around for the prog change stuffā€¦ Not that this should have to be the fix as it doesnā€™t look like it needs to be an issue

3 Likes
#70

Yeah, reallyā€¦ itĀ“s too bad that the multimap donĀ“t work. It was a useful bonus to have.

IĀ“ll try the suggestions tonight and let you know of my results. IĀ“m only basically interested in Bitwig-related solutions since i donĀ“t use any other at the moment and donĀ“t plan to neither. So users that have had success with bitwig, i would love to hear from you. :slight_smile: Cheers!

#71

@Jimbrackpool not working for me, how does your setup look? Usb and overbridge or midi only? Bitwig?

Tried again with the PC plugin yesterday, no dice. Also tried to add PC to clips (empty of notes, but it responds to the lowest scale of notes just fyi, also chromatic IF i go above) but not working with clips either.

I use usb and overbridge, other midi commands in the spec work fine but not this. Sighā€¦

#72

Yo,

I donā€™t use Overbridge so I canā€™t speak to that sorry.

I send mine over MIDI, sometimes a direct USB connection to the Rytm, other times out via USB to my multiclock MIDI port and then onto the Rytm via a MIO 10 MIDI router.

In any event, it doesnā€™t really matter how you connect your hardware, if it can receive ā€˜regularā€™ MIDI messages from your computer (notes, CCs, start, stop etc.) then it should be able to receive Programme Changes.

Remember though in the Rytm you need to enable receipt of PC in the MIDI settings and define a channel that the Rytm should expect them on in Channel settings. My setup in the Rytm is with PC in channel set to Ch16.

To diagnose your issues Iā€™d reccommend testing that your Rytm can receive notes/CCs first on any channel/voice before you get into testing PCs, that way you can eliminate connection issues, dodgy cables etc and know that your issues are strictly limited to Programme Changes.

Once you know you are sending and receiving MIDI OK, add the Bitwig MIDI Programme Change Device to the track that will have your PC clips in it and set the required MIDI channel. Then add the HW instrument device and set the port and Channel on that too. Drag the HW instrument into the Chain box in the Programme Change Device and click the Chain Only button.

Then go to the automation lane in the clips where you want to put your PCs and add them - I guess you know how to do that already. I have one per clip on bar one beat one. Hold down shift while you are mousing around and it makes it easier to dial in specific values.

I have my clips starting at -1.4.3.00 and my CHNG set to 8. It works great for me. I just need to remember to switch before the last (or maybe 2nd to last???)* beat of a bar. You could probably get it lower than this if you want and change the clip start point accordingly. I think you need your Master Lenght to be a multiple of 8 too for it to work reliably. Mine is usually 16,32 or 64 becauseā€¦erā€¦techno.

Remember to set the same CHNG value for all your patterns. I always forget to do this.

Let me know how you get on. Happy to help if you get stuck.

Jim

*you get a feel for it eventually!

1 Like
#73

Thanks s million; i have of course set rytm basically as you describe. Channel and receive PC changes done like description.
But i use overbridge and i think it may interfere in some way. However, itā€™s not necessary to use since all i need is usb audio basically. I Will try and connect via My mioXM and din-midi instead, it might help. Will get back to you. Thanks for the detailed help! :slight_smile:

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#74

Is the following a viable solution? Got a midihub as well, but want to make sure this works prior to buying into it.

ā€œI set CHNG to 2 (the lowest value) and set the chng multiplier to 2x. Somehow this works when i am sending pgm change to the rytm from the OT.ā€

#75

It works with any elektron box and any midi processor, you can dive in with confidence.

#76

Cool, thanks! Does the quoted solution in my previous post fix the issue w/o a midi processor though or what are they doing there?

#77

Sending pchg between elektron boxes and from and to the outside are two different things.

But as soon as youā€™ll experiment with polyrythm, a midi processor will be your best bet for consistent results.