I don’t know. Part of my objection to this ‘false advertising’ meme is that it suggests Elektron have intentionally done something dishonest, which I don’t believe they have.
‘Overbridge enabled’ is a perfectly reasonable and accurate description of the products. Frustration about Overbridge delays shouldn’t spill over into allegations of bad faith.
I expect no one is more frustrated by this than the poor souls trying to actually get OB finished.
To be honest the advertising implies that it is already possible, so on that basis I think that a return is unlikely to be challenged by a reputable retailer, goods should perform as advertised according to consumer rights.
I don’t doubt it, but in the meantime this is of little comfort to customers who themselves are frustrated that they paid for something that isn’t as described, I do not believe that they created this mess intentionally, but the fact remains that it is unacceptable for customers who purchased the product to not get what they paid for. I hope that lessons will be learned from this and that Elektron will take whatever action is necessary to rectify the situation, be that refunds or other solutions, including working with retailers to ensure that customers are happy.
A retailer’s discretion over refunds has no bearing on whether or not there has been ‘false advertising’ by a manufacturer.
Alongside the paragraphs you quoted, Elektron make clear that Overbridge is a separate product which isn’t available yet. The Digitakt as a standalone unit (which is what we’ve bought) works as advertised, it will be* compatible with Overbridge. Overbridge is not available yet. All of these facts are advertised alongside each other on the site.
I’m not trying to argue whether or not this situation is acceptable. I’m saying there has been no false advertising - which is a very specific thing, and by inference no intentional dishonesty on Elektron’s part. I don’t like it when some users suggest otherwise.
*inevitable bugs notwithstanding
That was from a retailers website, no mention that Overbridge isn’t available yet on there.
Fine. But there are people on here suggesting things like class action lawsuits against Elektron for false advertising. The content of a retailer’s website is not pertinent to that.
regardless of OB status, I find it ridiculous that a sampler cannot backup it samples after it has been relased now for 9 monthes ? this is an essential for a sampler. it is like a car with a tank which has not a hole to refill
Just to be clear. I only own an OT Mk1, so Overbridge is not a issue or of any interest to me personally (even if I would have owned gear that was compatible). I just want to tell those who feel mislead that all hope is not gone. I’m not saying that there has been any false advertising. I just wanted to chime in with my experience of using my consumer rights. I see a lot of parallells to my experience where I was able to return my Akai Advance 49 after 7 months because of it not performing like I had been made to believe/expect.
Sure.
The only point I’m trying to weigh in on is the very specific one about false advertising. You may well be right that a retailer would accept a return because Overbridge has been delayed, but that isn’t the same thing. I appreciate you may not be saying that, but others appear to be.
Wow, lots of lawyers on here. My last post showed that the manual says you need DT OS 1.10 in order to use OB. We only have DT OS 1.06 as the latest version, ergo the machine is not enabled. Is this a case of false advertising? Are the statements made on the packaging or the website false advertising? Regardless of the analysis of semantics above, the statements made by Elektron may not be explicit enough for some of you (the manual notwithstanding), but it is implicit that DT and OB are available are ready to use together out of the box. Anyhow, there are ways to test the views that are being expressed…
No idea if that’s the right place to start and I’m not quite there yet. However, if there is no announcement on the date soon, it’s probably the way I am going to go. It’s nothing personal. I don’t believe Elektron to be horrible people, but they are guilty of being inept. They need to publish a date and stick to it…even if it’s gonna be a ways off.
but it was always labled with „seamless computer integration“ without marks of beeing tied to additional software!
by know my DT is not connecting seamlessly!
yours?
for me clearly wrong advertised and is still the point why i bought it and the point why i will sell it!
I feel like you contradict yourself a bit in this paragraph. Elektron explicitly state that functionality isn’t available yet, but that it will be. Where is the falsehood?
The release date of Overbridge, a separate product, is not an explicit or implicit part of the consumer contract when you buy one of the boxes.
As I’ve said already, people are talking about suing etc - when you get into legal territory you can no longer dismiss things as ‘semantics’, semantics are all you have.
I’m not a lawyer, but I work for a consumer organisation in the UK.
And fwiw, I do think this kind of sucks. All the stuff about them probably overreaching, doing too many boxes at once is all fair comment. Elektron probably need to eat a bit of humble pie. But it’s still not false advertising.
Also fwiw, I sold my DT (upgraded to an OT and didn’t feel I needed both) and had to delete all my samples off it, would quite liked to have kept them. So I feel this pain.
Where did Elektron say there was seamless computer integration that didn’t require Overbridge?
startpage digitakt presentation …
there was never a word about needing OB for that.
after reading the specs you will realize that it‘s tied to. simple fishing with false facts!
Well, I’m not talking about suing and I doubt anyone will go that route because of cost. But there is an authority that is qualified to judge whether this is false advertising. All I am saying is that if Elektron don’t show progress, this would be a reasonable way to go.
Might be different in different countries. You would definitely be in the right if you contacted the consumer organizations in Scandinavia. It is very strict on not met promises. I don’t think you would find a retailer over here refusing to take digitakt back over here exactly for this reason.
You’re not. Others are - how serious they are is, of course, another matter. But I dislike the implication that Elektron have been dishonest.
Regardless of legal qualifications or lack of, what exactly are people saying the falsehood is?
Elektron haven’t claimed Overbridge is already available
Elektron haven’t claimed no software is required
I don’t think anyone believes Overbridge has been one big fabrication
So… what have they lied about? If we can’t even pin that down then it’s irrelevant whether anyone on here is a lawyer or not.
Giving an ETA and missing it is many things but it’s not ‘a lie’. At a stretch someone might claim that Elektron knew full well from the start that OB wouldn’t be available by Feb but said so anyway - but they would need to prove that.
Again, you may well be right. I suspect UK retailers would do the same.
And again, that has no bearing on whether Elektron are guilty of false advertising (or by inference of being dishonest), which is the only thing I’m disputing.
They may not have lied outright, but they lied by omission. On my Digitakt box it says “Overbridge is now free. Go to elektron.se”… Any reasonable person would assume that that means you can go download it right when you get home.
I don’t think it’s exactly false advertising either. More like not delivering promised functionality within a reasonable time frame. Also keep in mind that the February date was already a substantial delay and that overbridge is not the only core functionality that had substantial delays and some (though their mostly linked to overbridge) like backup is still not delivered. For someone like me who preordered a year ago this has not been a good experience. I do however count on Elektron to make this right.
I actually think their communication is pretty good. Simon reached out to the forum etc.
Make a call to Akai when your MPC live doesn’t work an see what happens… just saying…
