Ok good.
My thoughts? Time to fuck off to the other British thread.
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Is it more wee than this one?
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I believe what @Altro is talking about is using our newfound freedom to set up something like low tariff zones to encourage certain businesses to set up manufacturing plants or technology parks and create jobs/demand or stuff like that. I’m not sure they were advocating for letting big business get away without paying tax, especially because that’s been the status quo for the last 30 years or so…
The point is that it’s a bit surprising that our government haven’t even managed to pull their finger out and do something as simple as that. The implication being that they’re all having far too much fun speculating and making a fortune on all the chaos they’re causing to worry about simple things like actually governing. And if they did actually bother, then some actual benefits to this shit show might actually start to materialise.
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Actual bang on there, where’s the impetus to fix shit when the chaos pays so well for those high enough up the food chain to be spinning the wheel of fortune…
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I meant the illusion of democracy in the UK where commentators like to throw stones at the EU, which is fundamentally more democratic - whether it’s the House of Lords, illegal populace manipulation by well funded Namibian diamond mine owners funded by Russians or the sheer comedy of Tory vs Labour facade …
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Considering how far UK politics has fallen over the past 20 years or so, it really isn’t surprising at all. It’s this constant demonstration of complete ineptitude that puts the absolute fear in me!
In the grand scheme of things, Brexit is done. Sure there are some big issues still to tackle but for the vast majority of us there absolutely is an element of needing to suck it up and move on. A stiff upper lip and all that classic British bollocks Brexiters love. We may never close the gap of the hypothetical “had Brexit not happened” fantasy but fuck me someone needs to do something. The levels of incompetence is staggering. You know it’s shit when you can look back on Theresa May and think those were good days!
I wrote earlier that I don’t want to pass on my feelings to my kids. I am furious about it all but I want them going into the big bad world with as clear a head as possible. It’s going to be hard enough to make a go of it, to get on the property ladder, to find their niche. etc without me constantly banging on with the"when I wur a lad" type chat. But our government is such a colossal circle jerk of ineptitude that it’s becoming increasingly damaging to everyone’s livelihoods. All focus seems to be on retaining some sense of control over everyone that trying to establish a new era for the UK economy is barely registering with the clowns.
Many want to move on and get on with it but it’s mighty hard when you’re constantly getting the pish ripped out of you.
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The UK electorate is incredible. They are in bed with a corrupt political elite, driven by a London money class caste system - where the sole beacon of any sort of social values was the EU. So they kicked the EU out!
You make your bed you lie in it.
Probably made more difficult by legislation to ban protesting or any bad vibes against government power.
I do worry about how Brexit will allow the elite destroy what was a jewel in the EU crown, just as Putin would have wanted and the phenomenally successful disinformation campaign funded by Russia, the investigation of which has been killed by those in power.
And to be clear, this is coming from a view of great comraderie, rapport and love for the UK. It’s the dire political perversion of logic and liberty I am worried about.
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I think these are good ideas and ones we would have expected straight from the bat.
If the government really wanted to tax the big corps (and make them pay what they should - just like the average joe does), they would find a way to legislate and close off the loopholes allowing there to be a lower corporation tax threshold overall or alternatively a more defined banding based on varying metrics - as a way to also control monopolisation.
They also aren’t using the legislation available to stop monopolisation.
The lobbying and pay offs / back handers as well as the gov / mp’s all lining their own pockets themselves mean that most of them have tied their own hands behind their backs and are benefiting from the gravy train.
Thinking we just keep raising corp tax and that’s the answer is counter productive, it’s just the average business owner that suffer along with rising costs from suppliers / supply chains and for consumers, meaning that companies have to operate with reduced staff - lay-offs or wages not keeping up with inflation.
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Yes Davos is only filled with UK Gov/Biz.
If you want to know the real corrupt political elite then you should look into the City of London, Washington and Vatican, central bankers and other families to understand they operate out of the jurisdiction of the respective countries electorate.
Debatable.
If you look at things on a systemic level, the fundamentals of UK democracy are strong. The problem is that our democracy relies on a lot of conventions and rules that are far less codified than more modern constitutional governmental systems. To put it simply, our democracy relies on those who uphold it to behave according to their responsibility.
Theresa May broke that covenant when she refused to quit after losing the Brexit vote by about 200 votes. Constitutionally, she should have quit under the rules of ministerial (and therefore Prime Ministerial) responsibility. The fact that she didn’t did far more damage to our democracy than anything in recent memory. You probably don’t need me to go through the list of ministers who have since decided that Ministerial Responsibility no longer applies to them since then, but take it as a sign that the damage is done. Having said that, all those who thought they could dodge their respective bullets have all fallen fairly soon anyway, as all this drama happens in the public eye, and the public are watching. Whether they like it or not, our MPs are accountable, because they are both highly visible and their responsibility always catches up with them in the end. Our system isn’t so easy to codify, but in many ways it works very well.
My main issue with the democratic (or otherwise) nature of the EU is exactly relating to this lack of visibility. Whether by accident or design, there is a certain opacity to the way things are done in Brussels The EU system, though well designed and constitutionally sound, is remote from the people it claims to represent. Voter’s just don’t understand really what they’re voting for, and most of them aren’t really that interested. There’s a lot of people within that system that know this and are taking advantage and doing harm to that democratic process.
There’s a lot of really complex historical, social, economic, constitutional, legal and political stuff going on here that just can’t be reduced down to this thing good, that thing bad.
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Brexit…a very, very sad state of affairs.
Not noticed any difference.
Same old shite lol
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I’m a brit but I’ve lived half of my adult life in the Netherlands. I’m relatively happy here but I really miss England, my old friends and of course my family. Maybe it’s just nostalgia but I often think of moving back though I am warned constantly that that would be a terrible idea for multiple reasons post Brexit.
My parents and closer siblings voted remain while the rest of my family voted leave (and I have a big family). I am respectful of the differences of opinion, knowledge, lack of or otherwise. If anything, and on a very personal note it’s incredible how divisive this has been - imo it’s populism on steroids. Regardless of the geographic, logistic, political, financial complexity, Brexit has also contributed to a lot of ‘social’ and ‘psychological’ upheaval. Simply put, it has also ripped families apart. I’m more concerned about that kind of ‘shit show’ than anything else.
Personally I’ve alway’s been a europhile. As a kid I always loved the idea of being able to move freely across the continent, to learn other languages and learn from other cultures. I wanted to enrich my life.
With Brexit I feel that the UK has lost so much more than it realises or really fully understands. It has also made me an outcast. I will always feel alien in the Netherlands because I am British - that will never change but now I feel just as alien when I visit my old friends and family back ‘home’ the UK. I understand that this is only ‘my little story’ but it’s how I identify with what I honestly believe was always going to be a shitshow.
I didn’t need a political campaign, a manifesto or a book of densely printed jargon to know any of this.
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its a shit show… not sure i can add any more to what has already been said.
Thanks for the interpretation.
Free-trade zones… Why didn’t they just say so? Why the jingoism and anti-EU Illuminati-talk? Why the Labour-bashing, when the UK has had 12 years of right-wing plutocracy? I just don’t get it, but I suppose no one really does. Good night all.
Never trust a Tory.
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Epistocrats like Jason Brennan would probably say, that if voters are that ignorant of politics, then maybe it’s the only good thing about a democracy, that its opaque processes and institutions allow politicians to alter and twist the will of the electorate and by that keep everything from going to shit
It’s difficult for most to step out of the left/right paradigm. I choose neither. It’s designed to keep us divided. You need an open mind to step out of it and sadly not enough ever want to…
Repeating the insanity of voting Cons>Labour>Cons>Labour in our 2 party false democracy.
Lets not tho look behind the curtain, who funds who, who is in the pocket of other entities, it’s too uncomfortable for some.
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Is this the therapy group?
Didn’t vote for it. Could see the many negatives involved and could see the people selling it were the type of horrible people that I didn’t trust and didn’t have traits of genuine good honest people.
I didn’t think so many people would trust the worst type of people with no history of doing good previously, while the people with good records for doing good were telling us about the benfits of remaining, but here we are.
I find it depressing that politicians aren’t talking about how it was a terrible idea because they know they will be lambs to the slaughter by the mostly nasty UK press. But I find it depressing that that we as a people don’t make out voices heard collectively. That’s if I let myself dwell on thinking about it, so generally try not to think about it.
It can’t be undone any time soon.