Annoyed by ableton

Elektron Software Overbridge
#1

Another time I am annoyed by using a computer in my setup.

By only using Elektron, I turn on my machines and start to play. I love it and the time between the moment I want to make music and the moment I make music is extraordinary short.

When I want to make music with Ableton, I have to turn on my computer, start overbridge, start ableton, and deal with a lot of things I always have to deal with when using ableton.

after 5 times of hassle in a row, I turn of my computer and play with my elektron machines again.

#2

RI used to let Live call me back in.
You can kick too, one day at a time.

Seriously though, after all these years of hardware vs Live, Iā€™ve realized I get the most out of it if I just use it with nothing more than my mouse pad.

#3

I hear ya.

I have a love/hate relationship with Live. Recently, out of the blue, Live has seen fit to crash immediately upon starting. Get the error dialogue box, etc. Then upon trying to start the second time, everything works, but yeah, this does not exactly inspire confidence or make for a fun start to a music making session.

Although, to be fairā€¦ Rytm crashed on me the other day as well. And pretty routinely when using the Sound manager.

My guitar never crashes!

#4

Yes. Stand alone application please!!! Just give us the visuals and file management abilities!

#5

i hear ya OP ā€¦
.
.
.
i like to get up from my couch, leave A4 on the sideā€¦turn on pc, start ableton, and just plug in the usb to record the already existing patterns into abletonā€¦
.
.
.
trying both at the same time take a good bit of fun out of the moment!

#6

I totally agree.
A nice (and working) Editor/Librarian (VST/AU/Standalone) would have been a more feasible and practical proposal.
Plus, itā€™d have save many of us hours of frustration.
imho Elektron has begun building the house from the roof.

#7

Sounds like a workflow issue.

Are you on OS X?

A simple Automator script plus a Live template .als could make all of that happen for you after just one (power) button push.

#8

Sounds like me, only that I tend to rage quit my rare MPC-Rytm-A4 sessions and turn on my computer.

Suppose you could get yourself an ssd - really helps with startup and application opening times. On my MacBook Pro it takes not much more than a minute between hitting the on switch and having a live session up and running. More RAM also helps.

Maybe give Renoise a try? Just getting into it myself, and while itā€™s if anything more computer heavy than Live - lots of mouse and keyboard required - the tracker somehow feels more like a hardware workflow to me than most other DAWs Iā€™ve used ā€¦ including the fact that thereā€™s a steep learning curve and itā€™s pretty limited compared to Live or Logic. Really good for detailed sample manipulation, though. Probably less system intensive too.

Re standalone apps, I think there are bunch of threads already on this, but you could use a plugin host - [some of which have recording functionality](http://ju-x.com/Hosting AU.html), doubt itā€™d take much longer to open than a standalone Overbridge app.

Although I do wonder, given that not using a computer for making music is such a big deal for you, why youā€™d even bother with Live in the first place? If itā€™s just for recording stuff youā€™ve done on the machines, wouldnā€™t you be better off using a standalone audio recorder or DAT?

#9

so I turned off my computer and used the trilogy ā€œonlyā€.

This is the experience I want to have when I make music. endlessly tweaking, extraordinary fast workflow, just machines, no hoovering computer, no annoying screen, 1000 possibilities in stead of 100 000 possibilitiesā€¦

The lesson to learn to work without a computer seems to be repeating, and I am a slow student on thisā€¦

and the sound of ableton instrumentsā€¦ it is not half as sharp as Elektron equipment. You can make very strong and fatā€¦ but it is a different world to me

#10

Yep, if thatā€™s the workflow that suits you, then stick with it.

Although Iā€™d definitely recommend having a look at Renoise at some point ā€¦ it even has a limited form of p-lock per step adjustments.

Also sounds like trying to optimise your computer - even going as far as to reformat the drive/reinstall OS - would be an idea if loading times or crashing are an issue.

Funny though, in terms of workflow Iā€™m pretty much the exact opposite.

Current default Ableton template has Rytm, A4, Slim Phatty, Blofeld and Mopho set up as external instruments with OB/Max for Live editors on each, Maschine as a plugin for rough sample chops, short samples and hits, Numerology sequencer, Diva, Bazille, Monark, Synthmaster and Kontakt in channels, UAD Fairchild on the master, bunch of other soft synths and UAD/Soundtoys/Exponential/Eventide plugins close at hand, now with Renoise rewired in for detailed sample chops and reconstructions. Izotope RX at the ready for quickly trimming and treating samples.

I use push quite a bit, but mainly as an instrument for playing parts, if anything I find it quicker to use my mouse and the screen for making adjustments to parameters most of the time, only really use the push rotary controls for fine adjustments, live jamming and recording automation. Also have touchable on my iPad, which I use all the time for basic stuff like channel levels, and a bunch of TouchOSC/Lemur templates, but I only bring those in to play if Iā€™m really getting into detailed patch editing - most of the time itā€™s just quicker and easier to use the mouse.

I guess my setup would probably drive some people mad, but for me each element has its exact place - my favourite tools for various jobs easily to hand. I love being able to change up my workflow at will between samples, analogue, VA, FM, additive, wavetable synthesis, and playing pads or keys (even guitar sometimes), editing piano roll, step sequencer, modular sequencer, or now tracker with Renoise, whenever a session starts getting stale or I hit a creative block.

Tbh when I go for the stripped back ā€œhardware onlyā€ approach I very quickly get frustrated at how long it takes me to do things that wouldnā€™t even take 30 seconds in my DAW setup, the limited effects and sound palette ā€¦ also find little LCD screens and light-up buttons totally opaque and uninspiring compared to a plugin/synth editor/daw display, where you can see at a glance exactly whatā€™s going on rather than having to wade through sub menus.

Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

#11

I had the dark trinity and sold the Octatrack for Ableton Push 2 Live Suite.

So far itā€™s a different experience and less stable right now because of Overbridge. I like working with Push 2 very much and it reminds me of the Akai S1100, but then with integrated Lexicon, Eventide and SSL plug-ins on board! For now i need some more exploring and to find a way to recreate the ā€˜scene modeā€™ from the Octatrack.

No regrets that i sold the Octatrack, if there will be a Octatrack MKII in the future i am not sure if i return to the OT concept?

#12

Yeah, Iā€™ve been tempted by the OT a few times, still might pick one up at some point if the price is right, but really at this stage all Iā€™d want from it or OT2 is hands on performance features. Live and Renoise give me all the sample mangling and sequencing Iā€™ll ever need.

Still keep my MPC around for the same reason, basically do no writing or sequencing on it - my computer workflow is just so much quicker, easier and generally better - but itā€™s handy to have for playing back stems and samples when Iā€™m jamming with other musicians.

Granted, I find Live is easily reliable enough that Iā€™d have no worries about gigging with my laptop + Rytm + maybe a couple of synths, but Iā€™d rather not take the risk of, say, a monitor falling and crushing my MBP ā€¦ which happened to a friend of mine. Plus, an all in one plug and play solution would definitely be more practical than having to get Push and another controller or two hooked up.

#13

For me, using a hybrid hardware/DAW setup starts with hardware only. Usually one machine either A4 or Rytm, developing at least 50% of the track. Then I add on the other Elektron.

I only add Ableton Live to the process once it is necessary. Perhaps I want to use Push 2 to bring in some weird Reaktor 6 blocks patches, or an eerie Synplant line to complement what A4 is doing (thanks to Liveā€™s ā€œconvert melody/harmony to new MIDI clipā€, itā€™s a fairly quick process), or I just want a bigger bass line so I load up Monark.
On the occasions that I complete the meat of the trackā€™s composition with AR+A4 only, Iā€™m only starting Live to record multi-track via Overbridge.

Either way, by the time I am adding the DAW to the process, Iā€™m so far along in the process and have so much working momentum that any DAW based annoyances donā€™t really slow things down or side-track the goal of completing the track.

#14

You are going to the same issue with any DAW. Not just Ableton.

Just keep your computer on. Most computers these days can be kept on 24/7 without any issues. And as few have mentioned, create a OB template that loads automatically when Live starts.

Make your tracks as you would on the Elektron boxes without the computer and just use Live to record and maybe add some effects (compressor/limiter, reverb, eq, etc.) during mix-down.

This is what I do. Only time I use Live for sequencing is if I want to jam along for more than 4 bars with the tracks I created on Elektron boxes.

OB and Live has eliminated the biggest gripe I had with A4 (no individual outs) and has save me ton of time with messing with filters to get the mix right.

#15

I have my computer on 24/7 as well as Ableton open 24/7ā€¦this way I can always record or jot down ideas etcā€¦my new set template also includes everything I need to start (piano, overbridge, etc)ā€¦you just need to prepare.

#16

you can create your standart template. there you can setup all that it just starts for you and you can start jamming right awayā€¦

#17

I agree. I think this is the key to getting along with Ableton. Itā€™s a lot of work setting up your own ultimate template(s). But itā€™s worth it in the end. Take your time. Write down ideas for it while youā€™re at school/work.
Right now Iā€™m making my own ultimate Dub Techno template. Getting all my favorite instruments, presets, groups, racks, fx chains, etc. all ready to jam at a momentā€™s notice. Iā€™m even trying to make it easier to go from the writing phase to mixing phase by having most of the levels set correctly, for once! Plenty of headroom.
Getting all this set up, setting up default configurations for softsynths, etc. plus using the new Push 2ā€¦ wow. Very fun and powerful. Makes Push 2 feel like an insanely powerful groovebox.

#18

I agree. I think this is the key to getting along with Ableton. Itā€™s a lot of work setting up your own ultimate template(s). But itā€™s worth it in the end. Take your time. Write down ideas for it while youā€™re at school/work.
Right now Iā€™m making my own ultimate Dub Techno template. Getting all my favorite instruments, presets, groups, racks, fx chains, etc. all ready to jam at a momentā€™s notice. Iā€™m even trying to make it easier to go from the writing phase to mixing phase by having most of the levels set correctly, for once! Plenty of headroom.
Getting all this set up, setting up default configurations for softsynths, etc. plus using the new Push 2ā€¦ wow. Very fun and powerful. Makes Push 2 feel like an insanely powerful groovebox.
[/quote]
^ This +1
My next investment will be an INTEL NUC or a Mac Mini . Iā€™ll install it only Ableton Live and my most used and best supported plug-ins + Push 2 and my A4 + RYTM . All preconfigured nicely . Power on and off the Lutzi :slight_smile: .
Because for me there is no difference whether I now turn on my OT / A4 / AR or turn on my DAW+OB . At the end I always need a little preparation to make it sound good. (Imho)

#19

I agree. I think this is the key to getting along with Ableton. Itā€™s a lot of work setting up your own ultimate template(s). But itā€™s worth it in the end. Take your time. Write down ideas for it while youā€™re at school/work.
Right now Iā€™m making my own ultimate Dub Techno template. Getting all my favorite instruments, presets, groups, racks, fx chains, etc. all ready to jam at a momentā€™s notice. Iā€™m even trying to make it easier to go from the writing phase to mixing phase by having most of the levels set correctly, for once! Plenty of headroom.
Getting all this set up, setting up default configurations for softsynths, etc. plus using the new Push 2ā€¦ wow. Very fun and powerful. Makes Push 2 feel like an insanely powerful groovebox.
[/quote]
^ This +1
My next investment will be an INTEL NUC or a Mac Mini . Iā€™ll install it only Ableton Live and my most used and best supported plug-ins + Push 2 and my A4 + RYTM . All preconfigured nicely . Power on and off the Lutzi :slight_smile: .
Because for me there is no difference whether I now turn on my OT / A4 / AR or turn on my DAW+OB . At the end I always need a little preparation to make it sound good. (Imho) [/quote]
Hopefully thereā€™s a new Mac Mini on the way. I had a very similar thought recently, but the current model was released in October 2014, and Iā€™d rather wait and see if a new model comes along that can take 32GB of RAM and a faster processor so it isnā€™t pushing obsolescence so quickly.

#20

I agree. I think this is the key to getting along with Ableton. Itā€™s a lot of work setting up your own ultimate template(s). But itā€™s worth it in the end. Take your time. Write down ideas for it while youā€™re at school/work.
Right now Iā€™m making my own ultimate Dub Techno template. Getting all my favorite instruments, presets, groups, racks, fx chains, etc. all ready to jam at a momentā€™s notice. Iā€™m even trying to make it easier to go from the writing phase to mixing phase by having most of the levels set correctly, for once! Plenty of headroom.
Getting all this set up, setting up default configurations for softsynths, etc. plus using the new Push 2ā€¦ wow. Very fun and powerful. Makes Push 2 feel like an insanely powerful groovebox.
[/quote]
^ This +1
My next investment will be an INTEL NUC or a Mac Mini . Iā€™ll install it only Ableton Live and my most used and best supported plug-ins + Push 2 and my A4 + RYTM . All preconfigured nicely . Power on and off the Lutzi :slight_smile: .
Because for me there is no difference whether I now turn on my OT / A4 / AR or turn on my DAW+OB . At the end I always need a little preparation to make it sound good. (Imho) [/quote]
Hopefully thereā€™s a new Mac Mini on the way. I had a very similar thought recently, but the current model was released in October 2014, and Iā€™d rather wait and see if a new model comes along that can take 32GB of RAM and a faster processor so it isnā€™t pushing obsolescence so quickly. [/quote]
Oh, i thought that they got a re-fresh this year.
But as you said , there is no reason to hurry up :+1: