I wish to apologize for starting this thread. It’s just that it seems like I spent my golden years inside only to have them filled with sounds and visions of breaking glass and it has only made me feel under pressure which in turn has made me hard to interact with anyone but cat people.
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Ppl shouldn’t idealize their favorite artists.
They’re flawed just like we all are. They’re every bit as shallow, opportunistic, abusive, weak and narcissistic as anyone else. They just have more options.
John Lennon was a notorious wife beater even though he sang songs about peace and love.
That seems to be surprisingly hard to believe for ppl who have bought the lie of him being some kind of a saint.
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more than 100 million records sold in his lifetime
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So about half as good as Celine Dion then…
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or equally as good as Spice Girls…
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That song was made by Eno
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Halsey made an album with Trent Reznor and Atticus Ross. Also Björk in general. I could go on and on
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Spot on. Musical geniuses often have a flawed personality. Bowie had a lot of issues but id take those issues anyday for the legacy. And Major Tom says fu ck to anyone who disagrees.
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there are so many great bowie songs, maybe meet me at the “what are you listening to lately” thread. I love Bowie !
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To me the beauty of Bowie is the music and performance. Will love that forever. Otherwise he probably did plenty of sexually and ethically questionable things that are worthy of condemnation. But since I don’t idolize him, I don’t feel any conflict there. I just get to listen to Low and realize that a large chunk of stars from this day got really loaded, had dangerous concepts of power over people, and did things that today everyone pretends they wouldnt or didn’t. Good to draw the distinction between his rights and wrongs if the conversation leads there though, I think.
I also think it is only because Bowie has been repackaged to market toward modern notions of freedom of expresssion of identity, that all of his personal behavior is called into question here through a modern lens, trying to discern whether he is a monster and a hypocrite. If he was considered in the same light as other stars of his day, and not contemporary media-coached stars who know what to say to sound socially conscious regardless of their personal behavior, I think people would think about him in a more forgiving light.
Also i think going to bat for black artists in an era of all white MTV (where he held real power) was a show of good faith that he wasn’t really a nazi. But I think it’s for everyone individually to discern what lines cannot be crossed, and I respect that.
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Absolutely. In fact he had a black female as his main guitarist later on. He crushed a lot of boundaries right there.
Are you implying that because folk music did that, punk cannot have done the same?
I mean, both movements had a strong leftist bias, so they would both dislike hierarchy, and any expression of art that would please a bourgeois establishment.
Since many American folk musicians played a lot of actual blues, the very same can be said about folk music, right?
A huge part of what punk was about was not being rock music, but what you’re claiming might still be true for American punk music, and for garage rock and blues punk, but I think not so much for the European variety. Even though song structures song structures may be similar, I find that sound, rhythm, harmony, melodies and also topics are pretty different.
Folk music as in, you know, traditional music sung and played and passed down for generations.
to me, the real punk was hardcore. Discharge really left rock behind and formed a style as distinctive and imaginative as Neu! with motorik. Early English punk, the '77 variety is very much “just” rock music. American hardcore too, very rooted in the rock tradition musically.
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Wasn’t Neu the first punk band or was it The Kingsmen?
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Some say los Saicos from Lima are the first punk band.
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And I thought that Monks were first punk band. Well, so called proto-punk…
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ok can we just get back to hating kanye now, this bowie bashing is making me uncomfortable 
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I don’t hate Bowie, I just hate that documentary.
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Don’t know. But „punk es una musica de mierda“ is a nice punk statement anyway.
Later he also calls it proto punk and ends with ok we are goddamn punks.
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good songsbutt is better than bad songsbutt.