Finally got this machine and its a beast. One thing that’s breaking my heart is the pops when I try and sample something bass heavy and to a lesser extent, drums. Any workarounds? I’ve been messing with the amp envelope to no avail. Unless I’m mistaken it doesn’t really show where zero-crossings are.
I find the only effective workaround to the pops is to mess with the sample start and end times in very small increments while zoomed in. Then you have to just use your ears old school style.
For the envelopes I primarily turn the sustain all the way down so it works as an AR envelope. Setting the release somehwere in the 28-41 range is perfect for most one shots. Then I’ll mess with the sustain for longer samples and leave the release as is.
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Great, thanks for the advice. Was trying the zoom all the way in but found it frustrating that it didn’t follow the start or end point, unless I’m missing something. Will use my ears and see if I get results.
I have noticed that the BPM can be a off by .1 when I’m trying to sample. Thought it might have something to do with it. Not really sure as this is my first proper sampler. I’m slaving from a squarp, would it be best to have it as master? I remember seeing comments that it had midi issues but I don’t know if they’ve been resolved in recent updates. It seems to be fine for me except for seeing that .1 error visually.
Yeah I think the zoom just allows for smaller increments is why i think it works better.
I’m on the most recent firmware and I haven’t noticed any sync issues. I do only use microchops though not full loops in my samples so that may be why. I haven’t reply delved into live sampling so I can’t speak to that.
No zero crossing may be the issue
Strange. I’ve had no problems of the kind. I’ve sampled loops, one shots and live looped with the thing. Works flawlessly. The SP-16 has always been the master in these contexts, if that makes a difference.
Have you tried it on bass heavy loops? That’s where I seem to get it. Only on the end of the sample which is frustrating but can be worked around somewhat with release and using a filter. Weirdly it doesn’t happen on some plays of a loop.
That said, this machine is an absolute beast. I can’t believe it’s so cheap right now. The sound is very very good. It feels like anything you out into it is practically club ready. I’ve had it less than a week and I think I understand most of the work flow. My only annoyances so far are the pops, the parameter steps (having to go into the sequence screen to set them), and using it as a midi thru for some reason I have to set every time its turned on.
If you don’t need the better midi functionality of the digitakt, you’d be mad to get it over this.
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Yes, but maybe this is down to sampling workflow. I use the Toraiz midi sequencer to sequence a loop from my Prophet 12. I record that one straight into the Toraiz, so it could be that the midi sequencing makes for that extra tight millisecond you need to not get this issue. I sample a lot of bass loops and haven’t experienced this.
I agree, it sounds fantastic and the workflow is lightning fast. It’s not great at chromatic stuff, though, it really is a loop, one shot and slice kind of instrument. But at that, it’s pretty fantastic.
It’s unfortunate that it doesn’t just “snap” to zero crossings by default (or as an option) but if you look closely there is a very faint line where zero is… on long bass frequency waves it’s pretty easy to eyeball it when zoomed in.
Also, many sounds just need the attack set to 1 to make initial pops go away, not sure what the issue is on yours. Of course, loop points are a whole other issue, but it helps to have them as cloose to the zero line as possible AND have the waves going the same direction (up-to-up or down-to-down) when they meet.
Completely agree that it’s a beast. Sold my Rytm months ago and don’t regret it (sampled a ton off of it first) but need to have another Elektron box for all the things that they excel at, so the A4 is a perfect companion.
Something I’ve been thinking about is using the extra two midi tracks on the A4 (fx and cv) to loop back into the SP to sequence percussive sounds that would benefit from probabilty, unequal track lengths etc… best of both worlds.
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what do you like more about the toraiz than the rytm besides its sound?
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Well it’s been covered at some length in the posts above, but to summarize (for me):
- Stereo sampling: opens up so many more options, resampling thru fx, comping multiple panned layers, keeping the original stereo image of source material etc.
- Long samples: HUGE advantage coming from the DT and Rytm.
- Per track FX: Similar to the OT, but there are more creative options in the SP. Lo-Fi and Delay are stellar. Plus you can easily assign the analog filter to any track and resample thru it, in stereo.
- Screen: I haven’t historically been a fan of touchscreens, but it’s hard to argue the benefit vs Elektron’s cryptic interface.
- Pads and buttons: A big deal for some, not so much for me as I am certainly no fingerdrummer… but feel considerably better than say a Rytm.
- File system: Blows Elektron away in every respect.
- Memory: I wish the 8GB was expandable, but as is it’s 8x what the Rytm or DT provides… even if it’s really more like 4x due to stereo files.
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The pads for triggering the sounds. The immediacy of the Toraiz sequencer. I can blend song ideas in and out 8 pads at a time then I’m already plotting song ideas on the other 8 pads while browsing through samples folders.
The tightness of the groove engine with each percent of swing relaxing naturally. As a finger drummer who drags and rushes then tightens this feels Comoran,ev to my mpc 2000xl. Some beatboxes i use I notice two percent is where you can relax the quantize values between the notes.
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There’s something to be said about an instrument that doesn’t do a ton of things, but do them really well. I like that the Toraiz can’t be everywhere and everything, but where it decides to be, it’s really great.
Only thing I genuinely miss is streaming and polyrythm. And I kind of miss that a lot. But not so much that I’d give this one up. But more hoping Pioneer makes another sampler with all the Toraiz awesome and then slaps on some ever so slightly experimental stuff, Blackbox style. Don’t flood it, just acknowledge that even a funky DJ wants to do polyrythm from time to time.
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I still think a SP with built-in AS-1 and Squid sequencing options would be an absolute gamechanger. A true all-in-one solution for many of us…
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no individual track lengths on the sp?
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Nope. It’s old school tracker style, that way 
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For the first time in 18 months since I’ve started messing with hardware I’ve actually started composing with this thing instead of messing with a loop for 4 hours.
Just a bit of preset compression and limiting in Ableton but I have no fucking idea what I’m doing there. I wouldn’t listen to it myself but hey its a start.
I tried zooming in on the zero crossing but just can’t see it. I get visually where it is and can actually see it zoomed out so know roughly where it should be but alas I’m not getting results.
Also found it if you double tap the start or end tags so they’re highlighted the zoom will follow them when you zoom.
The pros vastly outweigh the cons with this device. Its amazing. I’d absolutely love the idea of a combo device of this and a squid with some of the kinks ironed. I’d buy it straight away.
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Try changing your angle of viewing the screen. It’s there, just very faint.
Works for the loop point as well
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Ok so thought I’d respond to this thread to help anyone else out who had similar problems to me.
I semi-fixed the clicks and the pops by making the Toraiz master. I had noticed a small latency at the start of samples but only visually, not sure if that had something to do with it.
I still get clicks but they seem to be easier to tame. The line @DonovanDwyer is referring to is only in the slice screen, not in the sample playback screen (correct me if I’m wrong). You can kinda go off where the line should be by drawing an imaginary line from the center of L or R across the screen. Also if you hold shift and use the scroll wheel while zooming in and out, it increases the visual amplitude of the wave allowing you to guess a bit easier where the zero crossing is. The wave looks a bit stepped when you do this. Not sure if that’s highlighting the DSP threshold. Would be surprised if it was. Holding shift and selecting other functions allows for fine tuning, helpful for start and end points.
Anyway I noticed having the Toraiz as my master was the main thing that helped. Pops still there sometimes but much more muted. That said I could be doing things all wrong. Pinch of salt!
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I actually never go to that splice screen, I see it on the standard waveform start/stop/loop screen.
Could it be an OS revision thing?
That I didn’t know! Will definitely help for quieter sounds.