The problem is that USB hosts are quite expensive. The Kenton is 115 €, the Retrokits RK-006 is 180 € (this does so many different things beside hosting though) .
Pardon the ignorance, it seems to me that most hardware synths/samplers are not USB hosts, right?
I’ll check out the Raspberry Pi.
no worries at all! Yes most hardware tends to not function as a host. The MPC One/Live does, the Squarp Hapax does…basically any device that has USB A connectors 
Do you have an iPad or maybe an old iPhone? With one of those you could use Apple’s Camera Connection Kit and a basic USB hub (eg one from Amazon) and you could route your USB hardware through that. If you do happen to have an idevice and have questions on how to do it, feel free to pm me.
Just get a cheap powered USB hub.
You’d need a device with a host function first (and the appropriate MIDI ins and outs), then you may add a powered USB hub. I’m using my iConnect4+ for that, however, there are cheaper devices.
There’s MIDI over USB but that’s depend what you try to achieve. It was added in Firmware 1.60 (you can get all informations in the Addendum of what all the firmware add — they didn’t rewrite the user manual it stuck on v1.00 the release)
I can control it from my computer and i can control my ipad (with a camera connection kit) and get the audio in the SP-16 inputs that way… and the ipad can control the SP-16 as well
Yeah you right on that the cost besides gears : midi devices, sync devices, cable, mixer, utility, protection and racks … stuff are usually underestimated… (in terms of additional cost)
N/A
I really wish the sp16 could do is legato/slide programming on internal/midi tracks.
Everything else I’ve worked around. But having to use two tracks for MIDI slides wasn’t great as it isn’t consistent between different synths.
Copy and paste of trigs would massively speed things up as I tend to use a lot of parameter locks etc.
I’ve also always had problems with the midi sync drifting over time when set as slave. So I always just record with sync and line tracks up afterwards. The internal tempo is pretty solid. Although at certain tempos and with a certain level of programming it can sway a bit.
No kits, I make projects and save the obvious things but then you can’t copy between them or load individual sound settings (envelope etc)
No live experience with it.
-Sound.
-Ease of use
-Physical layout
-Flexibility of the outputs - 8 out, four stereo, stereo master plus 6 individual. Using sample in as effect return etc
-the simplicity of the sequencer/arranger - again just let’s you get straight into things
Mine is in its box, and although I’m selling everything, I’ve not even considered selling it yet. I said very early on that I think it’s a modern classic. It’s a shame pioneer never fixed the issues it has (most of which are small).
Not sure if these are available where you are, it’s a Chinese company. These sell for around $60 for the newest generation:
Agree, it is a shame, the SP-16 has huge potential, it’s the one piece of hardware I am using the most, and it’s rewarding every single time. The 1.6 firmware update already came as a big surprise, and thus consider every SP-16 owner already on the lucky side.
As for the AS-1, except for the sequencer sync bug, what makes the AS-1 “painful” to work with for you? I know it’s slightly off-topic, however, since the SP-16 has a dedicated AS-1 track option . . .
You guys make me regret selling mine.
To answer @William_WiLD - I had one, got quite proficient with it but sold it eventually.
I’m a lot into polyrhythms, time signatures per track and such stuff, and the Toraiz is very vanilla in that area. So that eventually wore me down. And also, my long ass ambient noodles didn’t fit into the fragile 64sec frame per sample of the Toraiz.
But dear lord, did I try to work around these limitations because I loved working with it.
These days, I’ve learned a trick or two I didn’t know then, which might’ve made me keep it, actually. But despite its more decent price now, even if I could find one, shelling out close to a grand for a kit that I did sell once and for good reason, just to see if I’m gelling with it now, won’t happen.
If there ever was a new version of this that did streaming, step counts per track and unique time signatures, I’d go for it. I could sacrifice the Dave Smith filter and one fx slot, even, if I had to deal with the devil to get what I want.
Agree 100%
Had one, sold it. Considering buying one used now and again. The sound……
Yes. So crips and clear. Blackbox comes close. And the Digitakt has a certain shine, that to some extent compares. But I’m always struggling to get a good mix out of the Takt, and the blackbox doesn’t quite seem to punch through the mix like the Toraiz did.
And if I’d pick just one thing that might make me get one again, I’d even be okay with not streaming, if the goddam internal memory could just play however long samples I want. Even the Digitakt can do that. If I can squeeze my long noodles into the Takt with its meagre 64MB ram, just imagine what the Toraiz 256MB (or was that 512MB) could do with that limit removed.
You really summed up everything that’s great about this box, and why it shines above the rest. Refreshing to see a post that’s not pointing out everything that’s missing, which, when you get down to it, are really just nice to haves.
Extending and bridging my DJ sets for a more hybrid approach, adding live elements and other gear — The SP-16 (next to the later released DJS 1000) was the only device allowing me to sync external hardware via MIDI from Pioneer’s proprietary Pro DJ Link.
Con: Sequencer
Intuitive and fast to work with, but lacking the level of depth and variation (no probability, etc.) possible with those we know from Elektron or other devices
Solution: Sequencing from other pieces of hard or software when necessary (such as the Digitakt in my case, or from Live).
Con: Arranger
Works, and could be useful, however, it lacks the ability to interact flexibly within a live performance (have to add that I never used the arranger in a gig)
Solution: Use external hardware or software
Tip: You can select individual patterns of a set arrangement by hitting shift+rotary selector to activate any available row of the arrangement, and the chosen row will play after the previous active row, once ending its full length, independently of the number of repeats
Con: No reverb FX per track + reverb sucks
Solution: Live with it — then there are still individual outs for processing through external hardware or bouncing audio out of the SP-16 and processing further in a DAW
Con: Samples / Sampling
Sampling with the SP-16 is a breeze, but:
No sample delete from the device, though can live with it
No auto-chop/slicing via transients
No filter in the sample engine (I’d prefer that over sacrificing one of the FX slots)
1 Live / DJ hybrid sets
2 Live sets in conjunction with other hardware + iOS or Ableton Live
3 SP-16 only live sets
Both, depending on the scenario
1 Workflow
2 Instant results
3 Sound quality
4 LFO
5 Analog Filter > Main
There is a lot to experiment with the available LFO per track (wish there would be 2 at least).
Missed buying a backup / 2nd unit yet, but that’s on my agenda. Would prefer to have one in the studio, and one for the road, since it’s so damn easy to load projects from an external drive.
Anecdote: I only started to DJ around two years ago and my first main floor set (just before Covid) was with some bigger names at a Tresor Berlin anniversary night and played the closing. During soundcheck, all the other artists were standing on the opposite side of the dance floor having a chat. Played a track and then layered an 808 kick on top (I’m still having a separate kick track on the SP-16 for all of my sets, sometimes it needs that extra punch & bottom end) — the guys immediately turned silent, and then came over to check on my gear. It’s just great what you can do on the dance floor with the SP-16, the sound is just so club-ready.
I’ve seen a lot of people say it doesn’t have kits, but isn’t that what scenes are for? You save a set of samples in a scene and then switch between them during a performance. Or do you guys want to be able to save like a 909 kit for you to recall later? Even the Digitakt and Syntakt can’t do this (for that you’d need a Rytm).
One workaround to is save a default project which several scenes saved as Kits in the last bank, so you can copy and paste them into other banks whenever you need them for a particular song/track.
Yeah, it totally has kits. As you say, Scenes are kits.
Toraiz 1 - Digiboxes 0.
You’ve already mentioned the sync issues on program changes, although that one doesn’f phase me personally that much actually (still think Pinoeer owed its customers a fix on that one though :)).
I love the sound of the AS1, but find it not immediate enough to program. So I’ve mapped a faderfox EC4 to it, a really nice mapping too. So this is a real luxurious complaint, I’m aware, but I would love for the screen on the AS1 to show which parameter is being modulated when it receives Midi CC. That way, programming it via Midi would become an immediate affair. The other thing is that I would have loved to remap the attack/decay controls…I find it odd that they affect both equally, amp envelope and filter envelope, without an option to decouple. To be fair, the AS1’s interface is not really made for my use case, I just love the sound and form factor so much, I’d love to be able to integrate it better (live improv).
Well, you’re the guy that made me buy it (your enthusiasm on here when you had yours as well as saying all the right things about the device back then 
), so a “thank you” is in order
Right back to you, mate 
Anybody has an idea what Pioneers magic sauce is, to make their sound so punchy? Their CDJ’s have the same thing (it becomes quiet apparent when you DJ also with laptops and soundcards), but if i look into the specs their DAC’s don’t look very special?
That’s a request going back into medieval ages . . . seems most unlikely to ever happen. Not a deal-breaker for me, but it makes the sequencer useless for most live scenarios, hence I never even touch it. Luckily the AS-1 has the clock sync without triggering the sequencer setting.
Good points, but well, so little hope . . .
The Soundtower editor serves my purposes for programming sounds, not tweaking any other parameters live than those directly available on the synth without menu diving. Like you, I love the form factor, sound for sure — underrated, such as all Toraiz products.
